EDGE Interview: See What Happens When Julio Torres Loses an Earring on HBO's 'Fantasmas'

"Fantasmas" (Spanish for "Ghosts") seems an entirely appropriate title for Julio Torres' upcoming six-episode comedy on HBO. As Torres' film "Problemista" did, the show tackles bureaucracy with a mix of absurd humor and sharp-edged satire. But where that film, which co-starred Tilda Swinton, was focused on the tribulations of an immigrant trying to navigate the labyrinthine perils of the US immigration system, "Fantasmas" takes broader aim, critiquing everything from the health care system, to modern notions of fame, to the plights of working people, to the New York metro system. "Problemista" pointed out the talent bureaucracies have for pretending that people don't exist if they don't fit arbitrary rules and requirements; "Fantasmas" interrogates the underpinnings of human existence itself.

The narrative threads of "Fantasmas" spin out to draw an increasingly unlikely group of tangentially related characters into its six episodes, people only loosely connected by Julio's efforts to find a lost earring. That large number of roles makes plenty of space for surprising guest appearances (a number of them queer celebrities), but the show never loses sight of its main plot: Julio is terrified that a birthmark might turn out to be malignant, and, given his lack of "Proof of Existence" credentials, he dreads the prospect of trying to grapple with a health care system (let alone any other bureaucracy). Like Torres, a native of El Salvador, Julio is an immigrant; as a creative person, he feels trapped in a system that prioritizes profits over people.

Julio's assistant and his agent – a robot named Bibo (Joe Rumrill) and a performance artist named Vanesja (Martine) respectively – focus on him only intermittently. More off-the-wall characters include a social media manager that seems like a cousin of "Mr. Bill," the tiny clay man who featured in vintage "Saturday Night Live" skits (fitting, given that Torres used to be a writer on "SNL"); a trainer whose friendship with an aspiring influencer takes a startlingly dangerous turn; and a driver named Chester (Tomàs Matos) who would be right at home in an Almodóvar movie with his own Uber-like ride share service. That's not to mention a multitude of others with whom Julio crosses paths, like a compassionate middle school teacher, a disenfranchised letter of the alphabet, and the toilet bowl water (voiced by none other than Tilda Swinton) he makes a connection with when the chips seem well and truly down... the drain, that is.

EDGE caught up with Julio Torres to hear more about the show, discuss his creative process, and contemplate how representation doesn't just matter; it's inevitably present in his work.

EDGE: "Los Espookys" had a ghostly component, and "Fantasmas" is very surreal. What fascinates you about ghosts and surrealism?

Julio Torres: I don't know. I think that there's something inherently absurd about these fantastical elements, and I enjoy pointing out the absurdity in the mundane bureaucracy and our day-to-day lives. I think that fantastical metaphors are appropriate for that, maybe.

EDGE: Are you anything like your "Los Espookys" character?

Julio Torres: No, I don't think so. Maybe sometimes. I think our eccentricities are sort of similar, but in terms of our personality, I don't think I'm like him. I hope I'm not like him.

EDGE: Watching these episodes it seems like you're taking note of how ordinary people tend to get marginalized and erased by society and social institutions.

Julio Torres: I keep writing characters that are lonely, and that feel very isolated in modern-day society. I think that's where this idea of ghosts came from – we all feel like ghosts in one way or another, and like the world is strange. Growing up, I always connected with characters that were limited in some way – like robots, who could do so much and yet so little. My favorite character growing up was Pinocchio, because he kept wanting to be a real boy. I didn't feel like a real boy.

EDGE: Your character has insights into people, but also ideas, notions, and symbols. I can't help wondering if this show is an outgrowth of your HBO special "My Favorite Shapes."

Julio Torres: In many ways, this show is very similar to "My Favorite Shapes," and as much as I'm showing you different types of people, different types of beings, and they started as absurd and then hopefully they connect in some way – and some of them are just absurd for the sake of being funny.

EDGE: There's a lot of queer representation in these six episodes. You've said in the past that you didn't necessarily want to be a spokesperson for any particular group, but the representation is front and center here.

Julio Torres: It's not that I reject that idea. I don't, but it's more like I feel daunted by the conceit that I would be elected to speak on behalf of anyone. But I think that the representation that you see here is very honest. I made a show about the people who interest me, with friends of mine, and this is what it looks like. It's not formulaic, it's not aimed to check any boxes or please [any particular group].

I think these things come about organically when different kinds of people are granted the opportunity to make work, because then it's like they bring in their world. And this one's mine.

EDGE: I've heard it said that writers and directors who are immigrants to America have a clearer view of American society that people who grew up here might not have. Do you think that's true?

Julio Torres: I think that's an interesting thesis. I don't know if I necessarily agree with it. Here's what I'll say: I think that being in some way a little bit othered, in ways that don't necessarily go hand-in-hand with nationality, allows you a better glimpse of the inside [of how society works]. Spike Lee, for example, who I think is one of the greatest American directors of our time, is very American, but he has a way of looking at how people move, and societies, and commenting on them in a way that is very warm, very welcoming, and very celebratory. So, I think it's more of a question of empathy and curiosity. But given that what I am commenting on is bureaucracy and feeling othered, I do think that for those specific purposes my alien status does allow me to maybe see these things in this way.

EDGE: There's also the more universal question that you dive into of human existence itself. Is that something that's always in the back of your mind, or did you feel this was a theme that you had to address given the social and political things you're talking about in the show?

Julio Torres: I'm fascinated by the things that people need in order to function in a society, especially a society like New York. As someone who didn't always have all the things, I think I'm very sensitive to when spaces are not made available for everyone. Like, for example, the fact that now in the subways here in New York, you have [to have] your credit card or your phone to enter. Now, you can still buy a metro card in the more conventional way, but you have the feeling that they may be phasing out, which means that in a not-so-distant future maybe only people that have a bank will be able to move in New York. I think a lot of people don't think twice about that, because it's a given for them. But there's a tyranny to phasing out those who don't exist in those systems.

EDGE: Your costar in "Problemista" is Tilda Swinton, and in "Fantasmas" you have all sorts of surprising guest stars. Are these people you wrote for specifically, or did you cast out a net and say, "Hey, come play in my sandbox," and see who showed up?

Julio Torres: It was an open invitation to come to the sandbox, and these are the people who showed up. I love writing for actors, but I don't write for people I don't know, because I feel like that could be a dangerous game to play where you end up not getting that person, and then you end up seeing whomever you did cast as a consolation prize or something. So, I don't do that; I write for friends who I know will do it. Like, the character of Vanesja was my friend Martine from the very beginning. I adore her, and I want to work with her for the rest of my life. And then Tilda's schedule was one that, sadly, we couldn't have her come to New York to physically do something, but I was like, "Okay, do you want to be the voice of the water?" And she's like, "Yes, yes, absolutely!" And then I tailored that to fit her.

It's fun. I feel kinda like a tailor or seamstress, making garments for other people that want to wear them.

"Fantasmas" premieres June 7 on HBO.